If Jim Butcher continues to do what he's done to Amara's characterization in the first two pages of her first appearance, I'm going to throw the fucking book against the wall.
(Only at page 35 of Princeps' Fury. No spoilers, please.)
Where Amara is all, 'tra la la I'm a married women now, so I'm wearing skirts and not flying fast because oh noes, the peasants won't like it! But my husband likes me wearing skirts and making nice with his peasants and provides me sexual favors that make ME like not being the woman he fell in love with!'
It really bothered me, and made that scene at the end, where Bernard put the slave collar on her flat out disturbing instead of clever and disturbing and hot. I remember reading that scene and going, you know, they hadn't done that in the beginning of the book, I would think this scene is the best think since sliced toast.'
I'll have to go back and reread the scene. I was on my first day of new meds and a bit loopy when I read that part, so I might read it differently now, but I think I mostly read it as Amara adjusting to a lifestyle she'd never really wanted and finding that she liked it more than she'd expected.
The other scene I found clever, but also deliberately disturbing due to the potential misuse and potential for it backfiring.
I'm sure that was what the author intended. It wasn't how I read it, and it felt like a betrayal of Amara, who was always shown to be very professional and love her job dearly. (And yeah, I can see her having some backlash towards that idea after the last book, but I would have liked her husband to have been concerned about it and not thrilled.)
The other scene I found clever, but also deliberately disturbing due to the potential misuse and potential for it backfiring.
*nods* I think Butcher intended us to find it disturbing - I also think I found it so for reasons he didn't intend.
*heavy sigh* Way to fumble the Superbowl ball, Jim. I know you're not so coordinated all the time, but Jesus, anybody could make THAT catch!
I know I've said time and time again that Kishimoto and Kubo should be a little bit more like Jim Butcher...I didn't MEAN it to go the OTHER way around.
...Truth be told, I haven't gotten that far yet. It just seemed like such colossal character assassination on Jim's part, as Amara HAS always really liked her job. Also...I'm thinking Jim's been slipping up a little bit lately. It could just be me looking for it too much, or just an evolution in his writing style, but there are times his writing seems forced. It's STILL up there on the awesome scale for the most part...but I'm thinking he could do with a break.
Yep. That was me. He frequents the jimbutcher.com/forums and mentioned it on there at one point. Here's a link to his most recent posts, it's about the fifth one down. Fourth one down is pretty interesting too.
Also...I'm thinking Jim's been slipping up a little bit lately. It could just be me looking for it too much, or just an evolution in his writing style, but there are times his writing seems forced. It's STILL up there on the awesome scale for the most part...but I'm thinking he could do with a break.
You could be right. I mean, he's towards the end of two very, very large series - as much as I'd miss him, he might need a year or two to rest the muse.
I'm curious as to what you found forced, though.
And I'd really be curious to here what you think when you're caught up with the furies series.
Word. As much as a part of me hates the idea of waiting as long as, say, the Harry Potter novels for an update...I think he might be pushing himself a little too hard and it's showing.
The short story for Strange Brew. Nothing has really shown up as so horribly forced as that. Aside from a couple of things, like Murphy being damn awesome, it was NOT his best work in my opinion. It seemed a bit rushed and it was NOT the best time to introduce a new villain. I don't think Butcher has EVER written anything that disappointed me as much as this short story. Maybe it's just PMS, but I was crying with frustration by the time I got to the end.
Also, it took me a while to get into Small Favor. It might have been because I read the first five chapters before it was released (because they were released early as teasers), but I didn't feel it had as much emotional punch. I think he DEFINITELY pulled Small Favor together very well, but I was a little concerned that it took me so long to get into it. Turn Coat's beginning had all of the emotional aspects that the beginning of Small Favor lacked (with what happened to poor Kirby). However, Turn Coat also seemed to leave more questions than answers, as if he spent too much time planting seeds for future books. There were times where it struck me as awkward.
I also have a very long rant about increasing religious monopoly in the series, but my mom assures me that I'm chugging crazy juice on that one (and I'm actually pretty sure she's right).
I'm kind of frustrated because Harry is definitely on the list of literary characters I like a LOT and I find myself becoming increasingly critical of the series. As in, critical of little things that might or might not be there.
I'm hoping to catch up with Furies soon, hopefully before the last book is released. After I read this thriller about Russian Subs and maybe something lighthearted.
I've really enjoyed the last couple of Dresden books (Small Favors especially, but them I'm a huge sucker for Ivy).
I'm really sorry that the short story wasn't good. But it might be worth reading just for Murphy being awesome.
However, Turn Coat also seemed to leave more questions than answers, as if he spent too much time planting seeds for future books. There were times where it struck me as awkward.
It was definitely a step-up book, which actually gave me hope. See, I want The Dresden Files to end, definitively, at some point soon, because.. well, there have been like, eleven books so far, and... I want that story to get a bang-up badass conclusion.
I also have a very long rant about increasing religious monopoly in the series, but my mom assures me that I'm chugging crazy juice on that one (and I'm actually pretty sure she's right).
Oh, please, please, please tell me about this! Because in something in the book twigged my 'weird religious thing' radar but then I couldn't chase it back down. So I would LOVE to hear your thoughts on that.
I'm hoping to catch up with Furies soon, hopefully before the last book is released.
When you do, let me know, please. I love chatting about books.
*deep breath* Okay, increasing religious monopoly in the Dresden Files in three, two, one...
It started in Small Favor. I understand it because the Denarians were the primary villain, and Butcher tends to go with whatever mythology's villains are at work. That's fine. However, I didn't like the scene where Nicodemus says "you're doing the work of an organization that has manipulated and controlled humanity for 2000 years" or something along those lines. Harry didn't say anything, and Nicodemus had a good point. Harry took the time to have a philosophical debate with Kumori in Dead Beat, and while I disagreed with the view he took, he at least took the time to listen to what she had to say and he had a REASON for his stance. When someone makes a statement like THAT about the Catholic church, I at least would have wanted Harry to nod to the people who agree with Nicodemus.
Or, you know, maybe it's just my serious beef with the Catholic Church talking.
Then in the novella The Warrior, *SPOILERS* it was basically about a religious extremist trying to get the swords. While this had some VERY strong Christian overtones...it wasn't too bad. I don't really have a PROBLEM with it when the "don't force your will on the world" statement is made. However, it talks about a secret society in the Church and how they've been fighting the forces of darkness. Still not TOO bad, unless we're talking about the albino monk from the Da Vinci Code. What REALLY annoyed me was this statement at the end about how "God came and cast down all of the false gods that had been enslaving humanity".
Jim, you left out the part about how the REASON that those Pagen gods disappeared is because Christian missionaries crushed the people and culture of "savages". That kind of kills the "He doesn't want you to force His will on the world" statements for me.
The short story said some things along the same lines, which is part of the reason I cried. So frustrating.
I guess the thing is that I simply haven't seen many alternatives in the last few things he's written. This has been particularly disappointing because part of the thing I LOVED about the series is that it always seemed to keep everything possible. Things like how ANY article of faith could damage of vampire. The thing is that recently I get the strong feeling of "Well, you STILL can believe whatever you want...but there's only one right way". However, there have been some things that gave me hope:
-The fact that during his interviews, Jim Butcher calls it "Christian Mythology". It reminds me that he's still open minded enough to remember that not everyone hails the White God. I'm also comforted that he's clearly researched different faiths.
-He's refused to talk about his personal religious beliefs, because he says that they shouldn't matter. Usually if people want to force their beliefs on everyone they're vocal about "being on the right path".
-Turn Coat was the first sign of diversity in a while. Especially with Listens to Wind and how he clearly drew from Native American mythology.
Basically, what I see IS kind of vague. It's like how I've become slightly annoyed with Stargate SG-1 (because the ENTIRE PREMISE OF THE SHOW is the American heroes fly in and cast down the false ancient gods...yes, the goa'uld are definitely extra strength crazy, but to me that doesn't change the very basic symbolism. I can't help but see some strong Christian overtones in the show.)
The thing with me is, at one point you mentioned something about how everyone has their Things that they either see or look for in every facet of media. You mentioned that you tend to see feminist issues. Personally, I see religious stuff, even when it's probably not there.
In closing, I'm hoping that within the next book he'll show some more diversity. I think he can salvage it if he demonstrates that HIS BOOKS ARE STILL OPEN MINDED.
Jim, you left out the part about how the REASON that those Pagen gods disappeared is because Christian missionaries crushed the people and culture of "savages". That kind of kills the "He doesn't want you to force His will on the world" statements for me.
*winces* Oh, epic fail Jim. Epic fail.
-He's refused to talk about his personal religious beliefs, because he says that they shouldn't matter. Usually if people want to force their beliefs on everyone they're vocal about "being on the right path".
Very true.
-Turn Coat was the first sign of diversity in a while. Especially with Listens to Wind and how he clearly drew from Native American mythology.
Very true. I don't think I mentioned it in my main post, but I LOVED that fight. I want to get the pov of someone who is Native, but speaking for myself, that seemed like a great example of using a different culture without appropriating it.
What you see is vague, but it's definitely a pattern - and it's one Butcher would have to really work against, given that he has two characters who are both characters of the (broadly) same faith being asked to fight even for The One True God Thou Shall Have No Other Gods Before Me (Murphey and Molly's dad).
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I have it, but, being a new release and thus not having languished for long, it's at the bottom of the stack of books to read bythe end of the year.
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It really bothered me, and made that scene at the end, where Bernard put the slave collar on her flat out disturbing instead of clever and disturbing and hot. I remember reading that scene and going, you know, they hadn't done that in the beginning of the book, I would think this scene is the best think since sliced toast.'
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The other scene I found clever, but also deliberately disturbing due to the potential misuse and potential for it backfiring.
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The other scene I found clever, but also deliberately disturbing due to the potential misuse and potential for it backfiring.
*nods* I think Butcher intended us to find it disturbing - I also think I found it so for reasons he didn't intend.
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I know I've said time and time again that Kishimoto and Kubo should be a little bit more like Jim Butcher...I didn't MEAN it to go the OTHER way around.
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Also, were you the person who told me about the first line of the next Dresden book? Would you have a link to that?
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Yep. That was me. He frequents the jimbutcher.com/forums and mentioned it on there at one point. Here's a link to his most recent posts, it's about the fifth one down. Fourth one down is pretty interesting too.
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php?action=profile;u=5;sa=showPosts
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You could be right. I mean, he's towards the end of two very, very large series - as much as I'd miss him, he might need a year or two to rest the muse.
I'm curious as to what you found forced, though.
And I'd really be curious to here what you think when you're caught up with the furies series.
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The short story for Strange Brew. Nothing has really shown up as so horribly forced as that. Aside from a couple of things, like Murphy being damn awesome, it was NOT his best work in my opinion. It seemed a bit rushed and it was NOT the best time to introduce a new villain. I don't think Butcher has EVER written anything that disappointed me as much as this short story. Maybe it's just PMS, but I was crying with frustration by the time I got to the end.
Also, it took me a while to get into Small Favor. It might have been because I read the first five chapters before it was released (because they were released early as teasers), but I didn't feel it had as much emotional punch. I think he DEFINITELY pulled Small Favor together very well, but I was a little concerned that it took me so long to get into it. Turn Coat's beginning had all of the emotional aspects that the beginning of Small Favor lacked (with what happened to poor Kirby). However, Turn Coat also seemed to leave more questions than answers, as if he spent too much time planting seeds for future books. There were times where it struck me as awkward.
I also have a very long rant about increasing religious monopoly in the series, but my mom assures me that I'm chugging crazy juice on that one (and I'm actually pretty sure she's right).
I'm kind of frustrated because Harry is definitely on the list of literary characters I like a LOT and I find myself becoming increasingly critical of the series. As in, critical of little things that might or might not be there.
I'm hoping to catch up with Furies soon, hopefully before the last book is released. After I read this thriller about Russian Subs and maybe something lighthearted.
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I'm really sorry that the short story wasn't good. But it might be worth reading just for Murphy being awesome.
However, Turn Coat also seemed to leave more questions than answers, as if he spent too much time planting seeds for future books. There were times where it struck me as awkward.
It was definitely a step-up book, which actually gave me hope. See, I want The Dresden Files to end, definitively, at some point soon, because.. well, there have been like, eleven books so far, and... I want that story to get a bang-up badass conclusion.
I also have a very long rant about increasing religious monopoly in the series, but my mom assures me that I'm chugging crazy juice on that one (and I'm actually pretty sure she's right).
Oh, please, please, please tell me about this! Because in something in the book twigged my 'weird religious thing' radar but then I couldn't chase it back down. So I would LOVE to hear your thoughts on that.
I'm hoping to catch up with Furies soon, hopefully before the last book is released.
When you do, let me know, please. I love chatting about books.
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It started in Small Favor. I understand it because the Denarians were the primary villain, and Butcher tends to go with whatever mythology's villains are at work. That's fine. However, I didn't like the scene where Nicodemus says "you're doing the work of an organization that has manipulated and controlled humanity for 2000 years" or something along those lines. Harry didn't say anything, and Nicodemus had a good point. Harry took the time to have a philosophical debate with Kumori in Dead Beat, and while I disagreed with the view he took, he at least took the time to listen to what she had to say and he had a REASON for his stance. When someone makes a statement like THAT about the Catholic church, I at least would have wanted Harry to nod to the people who agree with Nicodemus.
Or, you know, maybe it's just my serious beef with the Catholic Church talking.
Then in the novella The Warrior, *SPOILERS* it was basically about a religious extremist trying to get the swords. While this had some VERY strong Christian overtones...it wasn't too bad. I don't really have a PROBLEM with it when the "don't force your will on the world" statement is made. However, it talks about a secret society in the Church and how they've been fighting the forces of darkness. Still not TOO bad, unless we're talking about the albino monk from the Da Vinci Code. What REALLY annoyed me was this statement at the end about how "God came and cast down all of the false gods that had been enslaving humanity".
Jim, you left out the part about how the REASON that those Pagen gods disappeared is because Christian missionaries crushed the people and culture of "savages". That kind of kills the "He doesn't want you to force His will on the world" statements for me.
The short story said some things along the same lines, which is part of the reason I cried. So frustrating.
I guess the thing is that I simply haven't seen many alternatives in the last few things he's written. This has been particularly disappointing because part of the thing I LOVED about the series is that it always seemed to keep everything possible. Things like how ANY article of faith could damage of vampire. The thing is that recently I get the strong feeling of "Well, you STILL can believe whatever you want...but there's only one right way". However, there have been some things that gave me hope:
-The fact that during his interviews, Jim Butcher calls it "Christian Mythology". It reminds me that he's still open minded enough to remember that not everyone hails the White God. I'm also comforted that he's clearly researched different faiths.
-He's refused to talk about his personal religious beliefs, because he says that they shouldn't matter. Usually if people want to force their beliefs on everyone they're vocal about "being on the right path".
-Turn Coat was the first sign of diversity in a while. Especially with Listens to Wind and how he clearly drew from Native American mythology.
Basically, what I see IS kind of vague. It's like how I've become slightly annoyed with Stargate SG-1 (because the ENTIRE PREMISE OF THE SHOW is the American heroes fly in and cast down the false ancient gods...yes, the goa'uld are definitely extra strength crazy, but to me that doesn't change the very basic symbolism. I can't help but see some strong Christian overtones in the show.)
The thing with me is, at one point you mentioned something about how everyone has their Things that they either see or look for in every facet of media. You mentioned that you tend to see feminist issues. Personally, I see religious stuff, even when it's probably not there.
In closing, I'm hoping that within the next book he'll show some more diversity. I think he can salvage it if he demonstrates that HIS BOOKS ARE STILL OPEN MINDED.
And that's a wrap.
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*winces* Oh, epic fail Jim. Epic fail.
-He's refused to talk about his personal religious beliefs, because he says that they shouldn't matter. Usually if people want to force their beliefs on everyone they're vocal about "being on the right path".
Very true.
-Turn Coat was the first sign of diversity in a while. Especially with Listens to Wind and how he clearly drew from Native American mythology.
Very true. I don't think I mentioned it in my main post, but I LOVED that fight. I want to get the pov of someone who is Native, but speaking for myself, that seemed like a great example of using a different culture without appropriating it.
What you see is vague, but it's definitely a pattern - and it's one Butcher would have to really work against, given that he has two characters who are both characters of the (broadly) same faith being asked to fight even for The One True God Thou Shall Have No Other Gods Before Me (Murphey and Molly's dad).