Fail, Slash Fangirls, Fail

[redbrunja]

You know what I keep hearing? What pisses me off like no other?

The slasher pov that it is impossible to write a male/female relationship that is equal.

Fuck that.

If you want to write about boys sexing each other, fine, but don't flat-out state that it is impossible for a fictionally heterosexual relationship to ever be equal, as well as implying that every single real world straight relationship is inequal to boot.

Comments

[nimblnymph.livejournal.com]

"but I think they are under-estimating the sexual politics that would exist between two gay men"

Depending on where they live/the culture they come from, this would apply. Some are far more accepting of homosexuality than Westerners are.

/Devil's Advocate

Not that it isn't a completely legitimate (and all too true) observation. I honestly can't remember the last time I read a GOOD yaoi fic that dealt with any social stigmas concerning same sex relationships.

Maybe I'll write one. And make it yuri to boot.

[nimblnymph.livejournal.com]

"Now THAT is interesting. I've always avoided seme/uke when I write yaoi, but I always figured it translated to 'top' and 'bottom' or something similar."

Mmm... seme/uke is one of those concepts that's really hard to translate directly into English, kind of like the honorifics. As odd as it may be to say, Wikipedia actually does a VERY decent job discussing yaoi and it's gender role assignments/history. I don't agree so much with their "pitcher/catcher" simile for seme/uke, but the rest is pretty dead on.

I think ... the closest and probably best way to compare seme/uke is pursuer/pursued. A major plot theme to the genre is to have the uke be reluctant for sex with the seme -- as a demonstration of the uncertainty involved with having sex for the first time. So, the uke is the one being pursued while the seme is the one pursuing.

Does that make sense at all?

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Depending on where they live/the culture they come from, this would apply.

True. However, I think slash generally has a habit of ignoring some of the sexual and political politics that go into having a homosexual relationship in most of the places where they're set.

Maybe I'll write one. And make it yuri to boot.

Please, please do.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Apparently not.

And impying that one or the other always makes one member of the partnership unequal is such crap that I want to check this person's head for brain damage. *GROWLS*

I know! I'm not, do you not realize what you're implying and how insulting that is?

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

*joins your spree of violence*

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Personally, I'm going with assuming that submission is a female trait, but yes, this reads as wacky, wacky gender/sexual issues in total.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Damn good point.

But, see, because it's between two men, THEORETICALLY at some point those massive power imbalances could be equaled, which could never, ever happen with a woman in the picture.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Exactly. We can write about SO MANY subjects - and an equal relationship between the opposite sex is impossible?

What kind of writer are you?

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Oh, I'm not saying it's not prevalent in real life or that it should be in any way accepted... but I certainly disagree that it's a.) a default in fiction or b.) impossible to write any other way.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Oooooh, that looks like exactly my kind of show.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

I completely agree. And whenever people feel the need to denigrate something else to justify why what they're doing is so quantitatively better, I suspect that they don't feel comfortable liking what they like.

About the only thing I don't feel guilty about looking down my nose at is RPF. I honestly think that is demented and no long, eloquent essays are ever going to cure me of the gut reaction that screams out against it.

Agreed. And I think the fact that it's using the names and images of real people vs fictional characters is what sets it apart from slash or het or femmeslash.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's when people start making assumptions not just about the person's beliefs (which, they've given us reasonable evidence for) but their personal life, that I get nervous about it.

(Not to mention that Freudian psych is pure squick.)

Yep.