I've Got No Use For Innocence

[redbrunja]

(It was hard picking which ~provocative~ icon to use for this post, let me tell you.)

The combination of a conversation I was having with fairest1 and reading the first Psy-Changling book (Slave to Sensation, which I’d heard raves about and is not living up to the hype) reminded me that a lot of fandom and the larger cultural context (especially with romance novels) seems to think it’s just so. damn. sexy. to have a virgin heroine. And I am just 100% not on board with this trope. Just… no. It’s almost 2014, can we please, please, please stop with this.

I’m not even going to go into how virginity is a bullshit patriarchal and heteronormative construction (but it totally is, and the more you learn about how and why it was constructed and the very real consequences of that, the more horrifying it is), I am going to stick with the fact that I JUST DON’T FIND VIRGINITY SEXY.

I come to fandom and romance novels for entertaining, titillating fiction, and do you know what I find sexy? People who know what the fuck to do in bed. People who have previous sexual experiences (good and bad) that inform how they interact and what they feel about their current partner.

I am so not down with the whole virgin protag that I don’t even like the male subversion where he’s the virgin and she’s more experienced (those two Steve/Darcy fics, excluded, you know the ones what I’m talking about).

Comments

[sugar-fey.livejournal.com]

Preach! I confess to enjoying the odd ~sexual awakening~ storyline, but only if it's done in a sex positive way that doesn't infantilise the less experienced partner or fetishise virginity, because yeah, we don't need any more of that thanks. Especially the whole "I never had one sexual thought before I met you" thing, ick ick.

Are there any romance novels out there you recommend? I enjoy romance sometimes but it's difficult to find anything good.

[borg-princess.livejournal.com]

only if it's done in a sex positive way that doesn't infantilise the less experienced partner or fetishise virginity... Especially the whole "I never had one sexual thought before I met you" thing, ick ick.

Thiiiiis x infinity. I'm a virgin, but damn if I'm pure of mind! I don't mind reading romances where the chick's a virgin because I identify with that, but then it just grates on me how often the writers c/p the same tired scenario where the character's basically a nun with no idea of basic human anatomy and 'le gasp, what is this stirring in my nether regions, oh my!' and bleurgh.

I don't think I've found one romance novel yet where the heroine's a virgin who actually knows what body parts sex involves and it's ridiculous, especially when set in the modern day. What is the internet for?! (I want to go find that Harry Potter 'the internet is for porn' vid now, lol)

[sugar-fey.livejournal.com]

Exactly. I was reading smut and thinking about sex years before I actually had sex for the first time, and fandom (and romance novels)'s insistence that virginal heroines never have any sexual desire previously as well as never having had sex before is kinda creepy.

[borg-princess.livejournal.com]

I was reading romance novels at age 10, which makes it a little hilarious that I'm a 25yo virgin...maybe too much time thinking about it in theory took away the urge IRL. *g*

I could buy regency romance heroines being clueless virgins since sex ed and the interwebs weren't around in those days, but what gets my goat is how after the first encounter (which is 99% of the time a magical, transcendental and life-defining experience of pure sublime ecstasy), they're transformed from utter n00bs to experienced pros.

The authors want to have it both ways - get their virginity fetish on and then once that element's dispensed with, these chicks are raring to go and blindsiding the hero with their seductive techniques and even a little kinky and...not that I'm against this at all, obv, but it's so disingenuous to have the heroine go from zero to a hundred in a heartbeat.

Um, I can't find a way to articulate what it is that feels so wrong to me here, but there you go. I guess it seems like denying the women the ability to express or hell, simply experience desire prior to the hero unlocking her chastity belt and validating her character's right to feel and act on lust? But only with him, mind!

Like, god forbid her lips have touched another man's prior to Lord One-and-Only, Earl of True Love, entering her life, but once they've connected, then BAM, she instantly has all these years of entirely natural sexual needs that she's only now allowed to explore and the experience that would normally occur through previous romantic encounters, 'coz it's too boring for the author to work on their sex life realistically if the woman actually had no idea what she was doing as originally introduced. only acknowledging previous sexual encounters would make her a slut because she should've known she'd meet Mr Right at this appointed time and been 'saving herself' for him accordingly

IDK, IDK, what are words even.

[deathmallow.livejournal.com]

Word. And please add for widows, "My first husband was a lousy lover/gay/whatever" so they're either a virgin or still totally sexually clueless.

Because a.) God forbid she actually have experienced TRU LUV before the Earl of Romantic-Fuckingdale and b.) God forbid she ever have had a fulfilling sexual experience. Only the hero is allowed to give her that!

But yeah, suddenly after one experience she's revealed as startlingly passionate and sensual and a "sexpert".

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

And please add for widows, "My first husband was a lousy lover/gay/whatever" so they're either a virgin or still totally sexually clueless.

Oh, man, that trope makes me want to THROW THE BOOK AT A WALL. Because that is one of the BEST ways to have a historical romance heroine who knows about sex and authors will throw it away to worship at the alter of female virginity.

Because a.) God forbid she actually have experienced TRU LUV before the Earl of Romantic-Fuckingdale and b.) God forbid she ever have had a fulfilling sexual experience. Only the hero is allowed to give her that!

That's how she knows that his dick is the One True Dick.

[deathmallow.livejournal.com]

Absolutely. I mean, as I said below, I don't mind virginity--it's simply a state of being, and I think realistic sexual exploration could be pretty fucking hot. I just dislike it being fetishized and then suddenly once the hymen's no longer an issue, the heroine fucks like the porntastic version of the Energizer Bunny.

The One True Dick, as carried by the Fellowship of the Wang?

I think my "favorite" Regency nobility (seriously, FFS, I don't give a shit about dukes and earls, let's actually hear about some normal people in history with real problems rather than just whining about how this woman is such a slut and only chasing him for his money) was the "Duke of Bedwyn" and it's like BE MORE OBVIOUS THAT HE'S SUCH A STUD OK.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

The authors want to have it both ways - get their virginity fetish on and then once that element's dispensed with, these chicks are raring to go and blindsiding the hero with their seductive techniques and even a little kinky and...not that I'm against this at all, obv, but it's so disingenuous to have the heroine go from zero to a hundred in a heartbeat.

Agreed with this so damn hard.

Like, god forbid her lips have touched another man's prior to Lord One-and-Only, Earl of True Love, entering her life, but once they've connected, then BAM, she instantly has all these years of entirely natural sexual needs that she's only now allowed to explore and the experience that would normally occur through previous romantic encounters

Errrr, I hate this. It's so frustrating how dudes have TONS of sexual experience but freaking just forget it if you're a girl. No past relationships for you!

[just-shai.livejournal.com]

*cough* Sophie Jordan just wrote a FANTASTIC book just about this.

[borg-princess.livejournal.com]

Ooh, for real? Is it her latest book which afaict is Foreplay: The Ivy Chronicles? Brb, ordering it from the library...

[just-shai.livejournal.com]

That is indeed it.

[tigerpetals.livejournal.com]

YES FOREVER

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Oh, I have a TON.

Jennifer Crusie: Bet Me, Faking It, Agnes and the Hitman, Tell Me Lies.

Tessa Dare, A Lady By Midnight

Cecelia Grant, A Lady Awakened

Suzanne Brockmann, Hot Target.

I'd also suggest the Magic Bites series and On The Edge, both by Ilona Andrews.