I've Got No Use For Innocence

[redbrunja]

(It was hard picking which ~provocative~ icon to use for this post, let me tell you.)

The combination of a conversation I was having with fairest1 and reading the first Psy-Changling book (Slave to Sensation, which I’d heard raves about and is not living up to the hype) reminded me that a lot of fandom and the larger cultural context (especially with romance novels) seems to think it’s just so. damn. sexy. to have a virgin heroine. And I am just 100% not on board with this trope. Just… no. It’s almost 2014, can we please, please, please stop with this.

I’m not even going to go into how virginity is a bullshit patriarchal and heteronormative construction (but it totally is, and the more you learn about how and why it was constructed and the very real consequences of that, the more horrifying it is), I am going to stick with the fact that I JUST DON’T FIND VIRGINITY SEXY.

I come to fandom and romance novels for entertaining, titillating fiction, and do you know what I find sexy? People who know what the fuck to do in bed. People who have previous sexual experiences (good and bad) that inform how they interact and what they feel about their current partner.

I am so not down with the whole virgin protag that I don’t even like the male subversion where he’s the virgin and she’s more experienced (those two Steve/Darcy fics, excluded, you know the ones what I’m talking about).

Comments

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

To be fair to Jane, her case doesn't appear to be viewed as virginity being ~sexy~ so much as another way that she's never really felt close to anyone (who is not now currently dead) pre-series. Though it might just be me 'cause I've never really seen it as sexy to have a character basically going "I only have a theoretical idea of what's supposed to happen now, this is horribly awkward."

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Though it might just be me 'cause I've never really seen it as sexy to have a character basically going "I only have a theoretical idea of what's supposed to happen now, this is horribly awkward."

Same, same. And I get so frustrated that it's always the girls who are inexperienced. Anyway, I guess I just am not a fan of virgins and could do with less of them in my fiction.

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

I just see it as something that everyone needs to get through at some point in their lives (well, if they choose to have sex at all) and can just shrug it off. It's like seeing a character work in a shitty entry-level job, I suppose -- something that's just to be expected if you're reading a YA novel, for example, because not everyone gets that out of the way at a young age.

I recently discovered Courtney Milan, who wrote a couple where both were virgins(for reasons due more to deep-rooted psychological issues than morals) (and both were also perfectly capable of masturbating) and after a mutually awkward first time, the heroine went "Okay, I may only have experience doing this solo, but I don't think we did that right. Let's try again."

She's also written couples who were both experienced. One of which even used a condom, despite it being a historical romance.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

I recently discovered Courtney Milan, who wrote a couple where both were virgins(for reasons due more to deep-rooted psychological issues than morals) (and both were also perfectly capable of masturbating) and after a mutually awkward first time, the heroine went "Okay, I may only have experience doing this solo, but I don't think we did that right. Let's try again."

She's also written couples who were both experienced. One of which even used a condom, despite it being a historical romance.

I am a big fan of Courtney Milan, partially for the reasons you listed. The story were they use a condom (which had, bonus, a not!virgin heroine!) A Kiss For Midwinter, is actually one of my favs of hers.

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

Post that might make you more sympathetic to Jane's deal (http://anonsally.tumblr.com/post/72843175316/episode-56-a-dlgheogndb); short version -- in the original book, Jane turned down Rochester because he told her about a few mistresses that he had who he assures her meant nothing to him. It's not out of morals that she turns him down but the fact that she becomes sympathetic toward his former mistresses and fears being added to the list.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

I'm actually pretty sympathetic to Jane not wanting to sleep with Rochester, especially in the original novel, where I think her comparing herself with his past lovers is super-groundbreaking and says great things about Jane; my problem is fandom/romantic novels just fucking loving their virgin heroines and me, just about ready to rip my hair out about it.

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

Oh yeah; I'll only defend Jane (or, well, the individual right to decide you're not into sex) rather than the systematic fondness of virginal heroines. Seriously, if it's done right, it should set off an embarrassment squick rather than some kind of virginity kink.