![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
As most of you are aware, I stopped reading the Naruto manga a while ago (my friday morning are SO much more enjoyable now).
But I'm still pissed at Kishimoto for something.
And that's for ruining female characters with traditionally female strengths for me.
And also girl on girl fights.
I wish I was kidding.
I find out that Harry Dresden's apprentice, Molly, is a sensitive and better at mental magic (as in, she's god and your brain is clay) and I twitch. In a series with Karrin Murphy (poster girl for Badass Normal), Elaine (almost Harry's equal at raw power, better at delicate work, blew the side off a building because she was pissed), FREAKING LARA WRAITH, badass Warden Captain Luccio, and Susan who started as a scrappy reporter and took a level in badass to dhampir.
One secondary female who's a sensitive and I have to run through the above list to make sure Butcher's on the right side of how what I like to call 'The Black Lagoon Line'.
Fiona gets into a fight with some bitchy conwoman and instead of enjoying two girls in bikinis punching each other in the face, I have to mentally tabulate every badass thing Fiona has done (disarming a mugger and hitting him with his own gun, driving off two carload of killers with Molotov cocktails she made in under two minutes, blowing up a car, blowing up a car, blowing up a car, blowing up a truck, tasering a guy, basically tasering herself to drop another guy, knocking someone out with a snow globe, disarming an armed forger with her shoe) before I can relax and enjoy the fight scene that at this point, is over.
God only knows what my reaction to Katara would be at this point.
In summation: Fuck you, Kishimoto.
*randomly, I read a short-story by Jim Butcher on-line and I'm so disappointed that Murphy's first encounter with the supernatural involved Harry. So very disappointed.
But I'm still pissed at Kishimoto for something.
And that's for ruining female characters with traditionally female strengths for me.
And also girl on girl fights.
I wish I was kidding.
I find out that Harry Dresden's apprentice, Molly, is a sensitive and better at mental magic (as in, she's god and your brain is clay) and I twitch. In a series with Karrin Murphy (poster girl for Badass Normal), Elaine (almost Harry's equal at raw power, better at delicate work, blew the side off a building because she was pissed), FREAKING LARA WRAITH, badass Warden Captain Luccio, and Susan who started as a scrappy reporter and took a level in badass to dhampir.
One secondary female who's a sensitive and I have to run through the above list to make sure Butcher's on the right side of how what I like to call 'The Black Lagoon Line'.
Fiona gets into a fight with some bitchy conwoman and instead of enjoying two girls in bikinis punching each other in the face, I have to mentally tabulate every badass thing Fiona has done (disarming a mugger and hitting him with his own gun, driving off two carload of killers with Molotov cocktails she made in under two minutes, blowing up a car, blowing up a car, blowing up a car, blowing up a truck, tasering a guy, basically tasering herself to drop another guy, knocking someone out with a snow globe, disarming an armed forger with her shoe) before I can relax and enjoy the fight scene that at this point, is over.
God only knows what my reaction to Katara would be at this point.
In summation: Fuck you, Kishimoto.
*randomly, I read a short-story by Jim Butcher on-line and I'm so disappointed that Murphy's first encounter with the supernatural involved Harry. So very disappointed.
sorry for the edits
I figure I'll marathon the rest when it ends, but I seriously lost interest after they blew up Konoha only to have everyone lived, and after Tsunade was denied her Hokage Asskicking Battle with Pein. I can't look back on the dramatic Third vs. Orochimaru battle and not think of HOW FUCKING ROBBED Tsunade was.
God only knows what my reaction to Katara would be at this point.
In my mental canon future, Katara is a master bloodbending medical surgeon warrior, and her apprentice (whose even better at healing than her, to her annoyance, because Katara likes to be right at everything and best at everything) is a young man who rejects her efforts to make him a warrior because, no matter how much she tells him it's important, he just wants to take care of people, not smash them into little bits. Katara, who only likes to take care of people after she's smashed them to little bits, or threatened to smash them into little bits, doesn't understand him at all. (But she pretends she does and figures he'll pick up the basics eventually.)
Re: sorry for the edits
Re: sorry for the edits
In my mental canon future, Katara is a master bloodbending medical surgeon warrior, and her apprentice (whose even better at healing than her, to her annoyance, because Katara likes to be right at everything and best at everything) is a young man who rejects her efforts to make him a warrior because, no matter how much she tells him it's important, he just wants to take care of people,
I like your mental canon.
no subject
I've actually been having a problem with the roles of women in this manga since the beginning of Shippuden, because at least in part one, Sakura stood up for what she believed in, regardless of her lack of strength. Now, all the women do is cry about men and are generally in the background while other people try to continue the story. I was so angry at Kishimoto for not letting Sakura or Ino at least DO SOMETHING during Pein's invasion, other than have one of them scream for Naruto and salvation, as if he's some deity. Hinata actualyl did something, but she was just went KERSPLAT in the corner and almost died.
Sure, Kishi's said that can't write female characters that well, but that gives him more reason to make them kick ass like a guy.
no subject
no subject
no subject
(I'm reading Claymore right now.)
no subject
I mean, for, uh, research purposes. Yeah...
no subject
Fiona pulled a Michael when the villian of the episode was relating how she screwed over the parents of dying children and started whaling on the bitch.
no subject
no subject
With Naruto, I've mentally fixed so much that I've started to feel ownership - and how can I stop reading my own story? Yes, I'm a bit mad, maybe resigned and definitely over-invested.
There's one good thing about your experience with Naruto, which is that you've been able to clearly define within yourself what is acceptable to you and what is not. I wonder if I personally, let things go too easily. I guess the best thing you can do, is support and promote and write the type of stories and characters that you like.
no subject
And I'm sure I'll go back and binge on Naruto at some point.
no subject
Just ONCE I'd like to see the roles reversed. You know, spread the objectification around. I am soooo tired of people going, "GIRL FIGHT!!! HOOOOT!" rather than, "Holy shit, she totally kicked that girl's ass!"
I understand why you stopped reading Naruto. There are times where I wonder why I carry on as well.
no subject
And yeah, the whole Blair/Mouse fight was sheerest fanservice. It was funny, as well, but totally fanservice.
I know I'm going to catch up on Naruto before Sakura Con, but there is no need for me to remember to read it each week.
no subject
Guh. I would LOVE more abs and ass shots on Burn Notice. Especially Michael. Can we say, "ooo, baby?"
The Blair/Mouse fight WAS funny in the sense that it was, quite literally, a cat and mouse thing. And the fan service part was SO BLATANT that it makes me think the writers were making a total mockery of that whole thing. But at the same time ... I was rolling my eyes at it.
Now, Medusa vs. Stein ... whooooa, bad ass! I think that was my favorite fight in the entire series. I'm not sure I really dig the pairing, but as enemies they are amazing.
no subject
Yeah, I'm waiting for the moment when all the naruto people on my flist start gabbing again - that's when I'll catch up.
I really, really like Medusa/Stein as a one sided thing, were she's TOTALLY in to her, and he's screwing Marie.
no subject
They like to push the boundaries of the other, test for cracks and see if they can get the other to break. They want to see what happens when the other shatters, whether they remain broken or scrape their self up into something newer and potentially more interesting.
Geeze, it sounds really sick like that. Maybe I need to rethink this thing.
Marie grew on me. When she was first introduced I was like, "Oh, gooood... another one of THOSE tropes!" Meaning, the female obsessed with getting married NAO because, zomg, she's ooooold! But later on in the series, starting right around when they went to Alaska and Stein REALLY started cracking... she started coming out a bit.
no subject
I had the same reaction to Marie. For a while I more WANTED to like her than I actually did, and then she started to grow on me in her own right.
no subject
Yeah, I'm kind of annoyed how every time there's a girl v. girl fight scene, the automatic reaction from the audience is: "Hey! Break out the tub of jello!"
Every week, I read Naruto before I read Bleach to remind me how good Bleach is in comparison. (even though I'm concerned with some of the moves Kubo made in the last couple rounds of storytelling.)
no subject
Oh. My. God. Can we discuss how much I love him? He's seriously busted his way up there with Kakashi, Sanzo and Urahara for me. My ultimate crossover dream right now is him and Nii in a room doing nothing but playing chess.
Yum.
Love. Stein. Love the fact that Soul Eater is fairly level as far as male and female dynamics, too. Medusa is awesome, but I wish she either a) would have stayed dead or b) not died at all. She's a MUCH more unique and intriguing antagonist than Arachne is. Arachne is so... very one dimensional for me. Gorgeous character design, but she's just like every other villianess out there; she sits back, looks pretty and doesn't really get her hands dirty. Medusa was in it from the start, actively WORKING to bring her plans about. That isn't something you see a lot of in female villains for anime and manga. I like that.
See, right now I'm not so sure Bleach IS so much better than Naruto. The artwork is definitely better quality, and the representation of women is LEAGUES above, but at the same time ... count how many women have been taken out of the action versus men. Orihime is next to useless. Rukia is ALWAYS needing saving. Halibel is dead (SOB!). Two of the Vizard women are gone.
And all of them taken out by men, so to speak. The ONLY woman who has successfully taken out a man in a fight is Soi Fon, and she had to do it with the aid of that one Vizard guy.
Naruto ... is dragging again for me. I feel like Kishimoto is stalling right now because it's gearing up for the final showdown and he doesn't wanna see his baby come to an end. And that frustrates me. A good story KNOWS when to end. Dragging it out unnecessarily is only hurting the story line.
On a positive note... *squees over last bit* We can't discuss this further here, seeing as red hasn't read it yet, but I think you probably know why I'm squeeing.
no subject
I mean...I would understand Pein's power (he's Akatsuki and all), but ONE SHOT. Seriously. ^^; My Hinata should be better than that. -is resentful of Kishimoto's tendency to keep the ladies to the side-
I guess when I stop taking a certain story seriously enough, I tend to stop being interested in it. DDDD:
no subject
AT LEAST
no subject
AT LEAST.
*sigh* It's the same thing as Naruto stepping in as Hinata's proxy to resolve things with Neji after Neji beats the crap out of her. Yeah, Hinata learned that she could change herself, but she was still bloodily and humiliatingly beaten by an opponent that she was absolutely no match for, and in the end, she wasn't even the one who reconciled matters between herself and Neji: Naruto ended up taking over that job for her, which, IMO, he had no right--I don't care that Neji's "fate is inescapable" thing touched a nerve with him; Hinata was the one who'd been living with Neji's hatred for years, not him.
In the end, Hinata's role is really just to become a catalyst for Naruto to fix things, including problems that she should have been allowed to solve herself. Her fight with Neji and her fight with Pain really are the same thing once you boil it down.
Feh. I really gave up hope a while ago that Kishimoto would do anything great with Hinata and am now just waiting to see what kind of hideous plot nonsense he'll inflict on Kabuto: if Hinata does do anything significant (and no, getting together with Naruto will not be counted as significant) I'll be shocked. I still follow the chapter summaries when they're posted, but don't read the actual chapter themselves unless there seem to be particularly interesting bits in them.
no subject
Hinata is TOTALLY just an excuse for Naruto to do things, not really a character on her own.
Which is a real shame. But it's like - SHE is the heir of Hyuuga, SHE should be the one fixing things. Instead... Naruto declares he'll change things.
I have to admit, the scrap of hope I had that Sakura would do something awesome is dwindling.
no subject
*winces* I wouldn't put it that strongly--Hinata does have a background, personality and motivations that (originally, at least) went beyond Naruto. It's just that she's become kind of a single issue character since the time skip--Kishi resolved her family issues offscreen, so that leaves Naruto and her competence as a ninja as issues, and "competence" kind of went flying during the Pain fight, but anyway---
I mostly blame the timeskip for everything, since it's clear that Kishimoto doesn't really give a shit anymore, and the rest of the Rookie Nine have all been heavily shafted, except for Shikamaru, the man Kishimoto Would Most Like to Date If He Was a Girl (no, I am not making that up). Ironically, given the way I feel about it, the anime does a far better job giving Hinata (and her relationship with Neji) more fleshing out, which kind of sucks on one level, since it's not canon, but on the other...
Which is a real shame. But it's like - SHE is the heir of Hyuuga, SHE should be the one fixing things. Instead... Naruto declares he'll change things.
It does appear that the Hyuuga have changed a bit--now we have bodyguards around Hinata saying "Hiashi-sama will kill me if anything happens to you!", etc. and Naruto really couldn't have been the one actively causing that, since he was not in the village for three years. It probably does stem from the whole Neji/Hiashi getting things out into the open deal, but the rest (and Hinata's part) has apparently been worked out behind the scenes without Naruto's direct involvement.
Of course, Kishimoto being Kishimoto, he can't bother to show how it happened, but the Hyuuga seem to be about as plot important as Ten Ten ever since the time skip happened, especially after some of the stuff that's come up in the latest chapters.
I have to admit, the scrap of hope I had that Sakura would do something awesome is dwindling.
Well, she is doing something proactive right now, so theoretically, she could still do something awesome. Theoretically. Possibly. Maybe. :/
no subject
This is true.
It does appear that the Hyuuga have changed a bit--now we have bodyguards around Hinata saying "Hiashi-sama will kill me if anything happens to you!", etc. and Naruto really couldn't have been the one actively causing that, since he was not in the village for three years. It probably does stem from the whole Neji/Hiashi getting things out into the open deal, but the rest (and Hinata's part) has apparently been worked out behind the scenes without Naruto's direct involvement.
Good point. I have a feeling someone could write an epic fic about what was going on with the Hyuuga during the timeskip.
no subject
no subject
I'm not going to ask for recs right now - I'm making my way through Fringe and Claymore at the moment, so I'm good. (Plus, I'm at college, so... I have SO LITTLE free time)
no subject
Which led me to question why?
I think that (at least for me) part of the reason that Kishimoto's take on this sucks so much is that he tries to make a series where talents are very segmented from one member of a team to another, and he always gives the girls talents that automatically make them the weak link. One person's a healer. One person's analytical/cool under pressure. One person's hella strong and has a heart of gold. This is a very basic theme, the problem is that his characters don't get multiple ranks in skills (except the ones he has authorial love affairs with).
Look at Burn Notice (I know, I hate to compare the two as well). Mike, Fi, and Sam are all good at the same kinds of stuff. First aid, explosives, hacking, awesome spy shit, etc. Even though they each have their specialties, there is a possibility for each character to be awesome and able in a variety of ways. Naturally, this includes Fi. Even though she gets into a catfight, she has a set of skills that allow her to be strong in other ways.
If you look at the Dresden Files, you see a similar thing, but a little bit closer to Naruto in the sense that the line between character and talent is a little clearer. Harry's group fights are often set up like a Dungeons&Dragon's fight. You have a wizard, a human, a knight, and a vampire, and they each have their different attacks that they can each use to vivisect their enemies.
Butcher's different from Kishimoto in that he TAKES THE TIME to give each character a way to shine using their different skill set in a variety of creative ways. For example, a lot of Sakura fic will have her using her skillz as a healer to immobilize enemies. Instead, Kishimoto portrays her as a weak link in the group and unable to cross genres. Murphy's human and she knows her limitations, but SHE KILLS TREE MONSTERS WITH CHAINSAWS.
Kishimoto has arranged his world in a way that is so segmented and stereotypical that there is not much crossing of skill lines. Unfortunately, he generally gives the weakest portions to females. Sure, he makes attempts to give them superpowers in more combative roles, but those just fly out the window as soon as he realizes his plot needs the girls to be weak. It's a self-perpetuating thing.
For me, what it comes down to is whether or not those female strengths are being portrayed in a way that automatically weakens the character at the whim of the author. Traditionally female strengths are fine, as long as they ARE STRENGTHS.
no subject
Also, what both Burn Notice and The Dresden Files have is female characters (and male characters!) who are good at different things. The girs aren't always healers/support. Sure, you have Murphy who can't go toe to toe with Harry... but then you have Elaine, who likely could, and Lara Wraith, who'd probably wipe the floor with him.
In Burn Notice, in the first season, it seemed that both Fi and Sam were rather hapless and Michael was the only competent one... but that was BOTH FI AND SAM. It wasn't just Fi.